Bitcoin is a Hammer - clusk - AB23 Day 2 - NAKA Stage

0:00 and now kusk is here to tell us why all of this just translates to the fact that Bitcoin is a tool so please give him a an Applause and welcome him to stage very much for the for the warm introduction um I really like the talk that actually just happened right he's talking about the power of you know kind of the end right the power of Aesthetics and that bitcoiners should should basically live the best life not just be

0:28 you know bitcoiners but also just you know coincidentally uh be doing be doing cool stuff right I had this tweet a while ago that I just brought up um that uh actually Surfers and sort of astronauts these people Mountaineers these people fighting against like not fighting but but sort of you know challenging nature on a daily basis and challenging themselves are fighting in some sort of some sort of holy war um of sorts but but anyway it's a bit it's a

0:56 bit abstract perhaps um but I'll I'll introduce myself a little bit B more um I'm Michael mclusky also known as as klusk here um on Twitter my Bitcoin Journey started about about six or seven years ago with a surgery I had um and they gave me uh they gave me painkillers that I really didn't want to take um but I took one and uh then I thought it'd be a great idea to put all my money in

1:22 Bitcoin uh and it was the summer of 2017 and it was it was a good time to put you know kind of all my money in coin and then you know I sort of played with shitcoins for a bit uh not not not too much still kept a decent stack thank god um but uh you know started working at strike in 2021 worked there for about two years as an engineer um and then fortunately uh had the really cool

1:46 opportunity to become the director of a food delivery app uh called eumi and we we accept Bitcoin natively and we're growing here here in the country I've lived I've lived in El Salvador for about about two years um and so as part of that Journey I've been able to figure out you know kind of starting my Bitcoin Journey you know not living in El Salvador obviously most of us I think are traveling traveling from abroad or

2:08 originally from abroad um and seeing like the perspective of foreigners for bit you know relating to bitcoin uh vers vers on the ground here where you've got you know this jurisdiction that's differentiated itself uh with with Bitcoin um so we've got this graph here right uh it's just a standard distribution um and and the question I ask is is where are we with Bitcoin adoption right we're we're at the adopting Bitcoin conference um you know actually like

2:39 this conference has a lot of alpha because people are actually working on circular economies doing really really interesting stuff working with people kind of the human element as opposed to just kind of Technology bits and bites which are really important as well um so like I would I would wager to say like you know the kind of The Crazy Ones in 2010 2012 even 2015 are probably in that like perp purle purple you know that first you know that left tail um and

3:03 we're we're probably somewhere in the maroon section now um and each one of these bars right I think represents some some new change that as bitcoiners or people affiliated with Bitcoin holders um we have to be thinking about new Solutions right we're we're not dealing with the traditional obstacles that other other technology products have dealt with right with you know the telephone didn't have governments it typically arresting people if they're holding it or sending it or they're not

3:33 asking people you know uh for as much information um so the the the the bottom line is we're still early right we're still early with this thing um that's sort of obvious where do we want to be you know we want to get we want to at least get to this this green you know this kind of green section where uh you know we've got wider adoption we've got more people are interested or more people using it um using Bitcoin um but

3:59 like the bottom line is like most people don't care about Bitcoin uh at all right how do you get an apathetic population to care about a technology um you know my my my mom is never going to she just like Michael like I'm so proud of you you're doing cool stuff with the with the digital money um but she doesn't really care about Bitcoin and the answer is like you do not get them to care like

4:20 how we do that's that's sort of something like you're born into your sort of Interest like oh wow like I happen to be interested in libertarian economics and and uh I liked coding I lik gaming and I don't know it all kind of came together right but like that's that's sort of you know most people are not going to have that so how do you how do you get people using this technology that we know is something great uh it's

4:41 something special um I'll take a breath I've been like uh probably uh yelling here but I think the change begins with introspection right we have to like look at ourselves and say like what what do we do differently uh what are we not doing right and always be iterating towards some ideal right to be improving towards some ideal deal hello Nancy good to see you um so we've got this guy here he's staring at the Sphinx

5:09 this is a photo from National Geographic from around 100 years ago um it starts with this introspection it starts with looking kind of looking and thinking um but the the bottom line like I think as Bitcoin Builders you know we're still sort of at this like nerd table in the cafeteria uh we've got like our conferences we've got these like walled Gardens where we speak to our friends and we see the same people and the same

5:30 messages and the thing is like all of those messages most of them are true uh but are they impactful um typically the same message has diminishing returns right there's there's a law of di diminishing returns when you're saying the same thing to the same people um typically there's not going to be an enormous amount of benefit the hundredth time um so I think like the Bitcoin movement is a bit of a gnostic movement where we have this sort

5:55 of cult and we're in the cave and we're doing interesting things when we're experimenting but when we exit the cave um how do we present ourselves so we're at the nerd table we have to go socialize with like you know the jocks uh or like the music kids like I was probably like somewhere I was probably like the music kid uh um so I think like one big thing that I I would actually encourage is that we stop using the term

6:18 Bitcoin company uh the idea is if we're successful that every company is a Bitcoin company it's actually just a financial services company or there's a group I think that last talk was great it's like there's a surfing group but um you know they also use Bitcoin and and uh but they're kind of cool just because they're Surfers and they're like ripped and they're on the beach like doing vitalist you know uh stuff right uh that that's like sweet um so it ghettoize

6:44 Bitcoin um I'm not a fan of it uh and so my Twitter is full of sort of skitso rant rants about about things of this nature um and it's full of a ton of other things um but uh anyway we're building a world where all companies are Bitcoin companies famous famous Satoshi post from Bitcoin talk right uh I don't where where is it if you don't believe me or don't get it I don't have enough time to try to convince you sorry now

7:12 he's talking to people who are like really interested in Bitcoin they're on bitcoin talk in like 2010 like dude I'm 16 uh I I have no idea even what Bitcoin is I'm like I have no money like who knows what I'm doing I'm actually playing music at the music kids table um so like he's talking with people who are actually aligned on him on 99% of the things but what is he doing he's like actually working and developing uh for

7:38 for kind of us for the well-being of everyone who comes who comes after uh which is which is something quite interesting um sooshi is not thinking about those on the Forum he's is thinking about those not on the Forum he's building for them um so like there's this there's this mindset of like you know not getting too consumed with like the tool itself as as humans we're not meant to put a tool AB above ourselves as a god um now it's a bit of

8:07 a political statement maybe with like uh you see maybe leftwing movements uh have the hammer and the sickle above the elevated above the human um it doesn't matter that could happen with Bitcoin that can happen with a chair um but uh we have John F Kennedy here saying you do the things because they're hard not not not not because they're easy right going to going to the Moon um so the the the kind of thing I I hinted at at the

8:31 beginning right Bitcoin faces obstacles that other Technologies did not face because it's it's not just a technology um it it wields hard power right that Jason Lowry guy who like works for the Department of Defense or whatever uh blocked me on Twitter like a couple years ago um I actually agree with him uh but it's like again it's like the 1% you kind of don't agree on um but basically it wields it wields this kind of hard power um and and it's it's

8:59 threatening to existing power structures so how do you get a technology that most people don't care about and they never will most most people won't I don't I don't use cash or credit card because I like cash or credit card I do it because like art is cool or like Spotify is pretty helpful or what you know whatever um you get you do this through Aesthetics right Aesthetics with the surfing surfing is cool El Salvador the

9:23 administration I think has an idea of like what's cool bring the Olympics bring surfing bring surfing tournaments um bitcoiners pretty good pretty good proxy for a lot of you know maybe some overlap there um but Aesthetics on their own can be somewhat vapid right they're not you're not building um you know you could be like really ripped or like beautiful you know and and all these things um but you need you need something with utility right you've got

9:49 a tool here um you know we have a food delivery app which is just starting right it's we've got this thing we've got 80 restaurants we want to get to 800 you know pretty pretty soon right um you know how do you make an app beautiful uh this is something that that we're we're working on um more and more I think we did a decent job with strike but but but that's a different discussion um so the

10:13 the combination of these things is Elegance right the ideal I think when when you know when we think as Bitcoin Builders what are we building what are we optimizing for it's it's this concept of Elegance right you want an elegant app uh you want something that feels good looks good does what you wanted to again and again and again and and that's it it's a tool again just like Bitcoin um when we build Bitcoin into into

10:40 various products you know talking from the app perspective but also thinking about services customer service Etc um so you've got Elegance um people in crypto outside of Bitcoin they mistake Elegance for Simplicity or even stupidity uh right Bitcoin is so dumb it doesn't do this thing I want it to do uh it's uh you know it's boring um we need to add another layer or like uh metallic will like he'll do this whole thing where he's like well you know you got to

11:10 change it you got to change it proof of stick um but the reality is like Bitcoin is obviously beautiful because it's elegant it's a simple thing that does exactly what you want it to do every single time uh it's a digital simple machine right so the talk is is a is Bitcoin is a hammer um but a hammer is not a simple machine it's like you the lever or pulley whatever are simp examples of this um but it's sort of

11:34 like this really simple dumb Tool uh developed by a genius or group group of them right that that that we can then embed in so many different products projects Etc um so Elegance is how we build soft power into products and services so as we've got we have this you know hard power thing oh you know this guy who's saying you know uh the Bitcoin is going to take down the US government oh like okay

12:04 whatever sure um no like the the the really interesting thing is like how to build soft power into Bitcoin um through you know through building beautiful things um aesthetically AES you know with kind of this this in mind um and you know Elegance again Elegance shows that we care uh as as bitcoiners you know a lot of bitcoiners that are coming from abroad uh coming to you know sort of developing regions and and working on circular economies there there's far

12:33 more circular economies I hear of that are going on in sort of Latin America in Africa and in Asia than we're seeing in in Europe the United States and sort of the developed World um and so I think it's even more important as a result that we build in um sort of really elegant tooling really thoughtful um design uh to to the to the products that we build as Bitcoin Builders um so this is a quote by Johnny I quite a

13:02 famous design officer at at Apple um what we make testifies who we are people can sense care and can sense carelessness this relates to respect for each other and carelessness is personally offensive um so I think as bitcoiners yeah we we need to I don't know my my my thing and and this is I I I say this realizing that I need to work on you know all the products that I'm I'm building um and building in in this

13:29 as well um so uh Johnny I pretty successful guy and he did it in the Fiat world right like he did it with you know how much more like if if if we believe like Bitcoin fixes everything it improves improves everything how much more like should we be building beautiful products as a result right if that's if that's really the case um we should be having better you know uh you know the this sort of Fiat mentality

13:53 that a lot of times we we criticize uh as as Bitcoin or well um so yeah maybe the answer to adoption is not another wallet or point of sale um these are these are very useful obviously for onboarding and for facilitating the transfer of Bitcoin um but like again most people you know they they want to go to like a concert or an event or um you know do do something do something uh travel travel with Bitcoin doing doing

14:22 things that you know building Bitcoin into products like that so we're doing that with the delivery app um and we plan on expanding that of course into probably other other other areas as well um media and culture uh and so yeah the ask the ask I have is to step outside ourselves and focus on this apathetic population um which is 99% of people uh it's just coincidental you know that we have like that I happened to be like in

14:50 my early 20s when I heard of this thing where I could kind of go along this path and and Etc um but this is this is how we push Bitcoin to the next stage of the adoption curve how we push it along and um go from that you know that purple area to the uh to the teal at least and then and then on to you know onto the rest but um anyway that is my that is my

15:12 talk um thank you good yes uh that's my Twitter on the bottom uh but um I think I think there's probably time for for a few questions yeah it's about 15 minutes if anyone has any questions or or any comments or or anything um yes Phil do think salad okay yeah that's a good that's a

15:43 good question um I would say you know definitely getting getting more employees paid in Bitcoin I think facilitating um better Payroll Solutions is is really just a critical thing I think the announcement that that Nicholas made regarding uh distribution and Industrial you know suppliers getting more suppliers paid in Bitcoin is also a key thing so that that level of the value uh you know high up there on the value chain is really going to do

16:14 do wonders for starting that circular economy and and and making it more robust yeah good question cool yeah in the back yeah

16:46 I think I think like as far as to I think it's a good it's a good question I think the biggest thing would be embedding it into like different events that people like regardless of if it's Bitcoin or not not like um something interesting would probably be doing a partnership with the with the soccer league or something where you have a really um big fan base that's really passionate um I don't know that's just an idea I have but it's possible

17:12 here in this jurisdiction maybe having tickets or or working out some sort of reduced pricing or incentive for for using Bitcoin and and people say like I don't care if it was Bitcoin I got a cheaper price and like I saw the same soccer game which is like that's fine so like something like that I think like using that soft power to yeah that's what I would say something something like that like thinking along those lines maybe uh but as far as like you

17:36 know I think the efforts that me Premier Bitcoin are doing for education is is definitely having an impact where young people are being taught how to use Bitcoin and they're able to teach their parents who maybe own small shops or work in different companies and sort of um you know maybe change their perspective I think like with hifumi's brand um we notice that our our color is pink and uh you know we do a lot of

18:00 Market marketing with the pink and like it's mainly like I don't know girls that are in like college who really affiliate with our brand and so like they're I like their dads are like ah like my daughter's you know so I don't know like getting getting Bitcoin through like the secur this route is sort of the only way um maybe not like spearheading with with with Bitcoin MH yeah uh yeah the back Don D Diego

18:39 I think it's best to coexist because you get you get a big a bigger platform um you get you get yeah and and yeah I think they should coexist yeah but maybe like building in incentives I think like in hifumi we're planning on you know kind of launching rewards but only launching Rewards for people who pay in Bitcoin first um and so you sort of have that soft you know push but it's not a deprecated product

19:04 as a result yeah yeah so I like the analogy between uh like nerds at the cafeteria like having their own table and um so I guess the question is vague but how do we make Bitcoin cool and is it important to make it cool or is it you know not really necessary I know the Aesthetics play into it right if we can kind of create something that's appealing to the eye for people or user friendly that'll help Drive adoption as

19:32 well but uh yeah how would we make Bitcoin cooler it's interesting I think lightning is a cool word uh that sounds like really D like kind of dumb um but lightning has sort of got interesting branding when I was when I was working at strike I was trying to say like this is this is this is going to sound pretty bad maybe but I said like um everyone anyone who's used like most people in the future we we always think

20:03 like for scaling that most people are going to use lightning or they're going to use like Layer Two maybe not going to have onchain transactions so it's like um like your girlfriend is never going to use Bitcoin she's going to use lightning anyway that's like I know I know Kiki is gonna be like tweeting at me like I hate you but uh anyway so I don't blame you I don't blame you for hating me yes yes last night I was at the launch

20:31 of the hifumi app and I found it very uh easy to use and fun and it makes people more open so can you tell us a little bit more about hifumi and actually this is Paving the way for Bitcoin being um easier to use also yeah yeah so like I mean we've got it as a payment method uh for for lightning now and I think Kumi you know I think we believe we believe a lot in the power of events right we had

20:58 this event last night and it was a success I think we actually probably had we need to make our lightning Channel like fatter um because we had so much outbound um but basically yeah having this interesting like you have this Tech layer but also branching out into events and culture is a really nice way of yeah kind of developing that soft power that that I talk about but yeah thank you yeah for sure

21:37 yeah so a lot of the products that we're building you know we run our own node and everything and so like some of the products that we're building internally um we're we're looking at yeah having having some sort of possibly custodial option and and non like some sort of non-custodial as well um so but we're working on this internally um hopefully news news to share soon yeah thanks yeah cool well guys okay I think that's good yeah thank you

22:10 yeah